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Author Topic: Cyber Monday: LULU Sale 35% Off Today
dan2448
Cosmic Superhero
Posts: 1525
Post Cyber Monday: LULU Sale 35% Off Today
on: November 26, 2018, 09:51

FYI: Lulu's Cyber Monday sale today is 35% off. (Coupon Code CM35)

I didn't buy anything this year.

The capsule description of the newly published "Market Forces" adventure didn't capture my personal, subjective interest.

I had hoped that, more than 2 years after the end of the Kickstarter, some of the other MP supplements that did pique my personal subjective interest (Situation Room and Abomination Realm in particular), might've been published and available for purchase on this Cyber Monday 2018. But as I have written here many times over the years, I assume that this work is borderline non-remunerative and almost totally a Labor of Love for the creators. So I want to be explicit that this is not a criticism. But it is an expression of personal disappointment.

When this website was started in June 2010, my daughter was 3 years old. She is now in middle school. I have reconciled myself to the assumption that by the time the last of the several other supplements mentioned in the Kickstarter is ultimately published, she will likely be in high school.

On an unrelated note, I have also had difficulty accessing these forums in the recent past, which has further reduced my ongoing participation here, unfortunately for me.

Hireling
High-Powered Superhero
Posts: 95
Post Re: Cyber Monday: LULU Sale 35% Off Today
on: November 26, 2018, 11:56

I too am feeling some disappointment with regards to the releases. I have been growing my play group over the last two years, and it has gotten so large that it has spawned two new MP groups--I'm doing my part to keep the game alive and spread the word. However, this forum feels like an echo chamber with posts going unanswered/unaddressed for weeks or sometimes months. After all of the work it took to get the IP back and finish the Kickstarter I would have expected more support for MP to be forthcoming--or what was the point of all of that effort? I've seen the creators already pitching new RPG ideas when MP is--in my opinion--floundering. The lack of "Actual Plays" out there to bring in new players is surprising (my group and I are in the process of recording some). BK's videos go a little ways towards that, but as much as I personally appreciate the videos, my players find them unwatchable. This leaves it up to me to watch, take notes, and learn the more difficult aspects of the game so I can pass them on in a more easily digestible form. I will continue to play MP and I even buy the old MHG published modules from time to time to convert, but it saddens me that my favorite RPG of all time has become stagnant. By industry standards, it's dead--but I don't put much stock in industry standards. I've always played what I love despite the trends and share those games with as many people as I possibly can.

dan2448
Cosmic Superhero
Posts: 1525
Post Re: Cyber Monday: LULU Sale 35% Off Today
on: November 27, 2018, 09:30

Quote from Hireling on November 26, 2018, 11:56
I too am feeling some disappointment with regards to the releases... After all of the work it took to get the IP back and finish the Kickstarter I would have expected more support for MP to be forthcoming--or what was the point of all of that effort? I've seen the creators already pitching new RPG ideas when MP is--in my opinion--floundering.

In my personal opinion from a distance as a mere 'fan,' I think what you're seeing here now is the culmination of three prior waves dating back to 2010:

1. 2010: V&V is Back! I stumbled on this website within days of its launch in June 2010. At the start there was an explosion of enthusiasm as a result of what, with the benefit of hindsight, was a premature announcement that the 'rights to V&V' (essentially, the Trademark to the name) had reverted to Jeff and Jack and that, after 2 decades of inactivity V&V 3.0 would be imminently published by MHG, followed by the republication of Bill Willingham's old V&V adventures, and more. Jeff and Jack actively participated here, as did a significantly larger number (than now) of enthusiastic fans. But this enthusiasm on these forums was soon mixed with heated debates by V&V fans about the legalities of whether Scott Bizar/FGU or Jeff/Jack/MHG owned the 'rights to V&V.' This debate ended up splitting the fan base into three groups: (1) pro-FGU, (2) pro-MHG, and (3) agnostic/non-committal. In the end, by the time the lawsuits started, the only 'major' V&V publication by MHG was essentially a reprint of the V&V 2.0 rulebook with a 'new' Jeff Dee cover (that had been previously published in the Living Legends rulebook).

It's my personal, subjective observation that things were never the same here after this.

2. Lawsuits Interregnum. At some point (I haven't bothered to check the exact date), the lawsuits started and an extended 'pause/silence' sort of descended here for a few years. After all the initial enthusiasm and big plans discussed here by the creators and fans initially, this extended, lawsuit-induced silence must, I assume, have sapped some degree of enthusiasm from each and everyone. I know it did for me.

3. Go Fund Me/Kickstarter. After 3-4 years (or that's my recollection right now anyway), Jeff and Jack started a Go Fund Me campaign to raise money to fund their mounting legal costs, followed by some sort of negotiated settlement with Scott Bizar/FGU and then the Kickstarter. Most of the online discussion I read about both of these crowdfunding campaigns focused less on V&V the RPG and more on a sort of 'crusade' for creators' rights versus publishers. While I've never seen it expressed directly, I have always assumed that it was a little underwhelming for many supporters of these campaigns when they learned that, in the end, Scott Bizar had retained the Trademark to "V&V," which was the core of the dispute (at least as I have understood it from a distance). The new RPG was called "Mighty Protectors" with "V&V 3.0" in the top left corner, under license from Scott Bizar. Like many/most negotiated settlements at the end of any long-running, sometimes contentious legal disputes, I personally wonder whether this outcome really, truly pleased anyone.

Hireling
High-Powered Superhero
Posts: 95
Post Re: Cyber Monday: LULU Sale 35% Off Today
on: November 27, 2018, 11:37

Thanks for the backstory, Dan. I can see why the enthusiasm has waned, but if they really believe in this game--and they should--there needs to be more engagement and outreach. A short adventure with pre-generated characters that they can send to game shops would be a great place to start. Anything would be better than the silence.

Jeff
Administrator
Posts: 1265
Post Re: Cyber Monday: LULU Sale 35% Off Today
on: November 28, 2018, 19:56

Hey, guys. Here's a couple of quick things.

We've enlisted technical assistance to try and figure out what's up with this site. Hopefully the problems will be resolved soon. In the meanwhile, there's actually a lot of activity on our Facebook pages and in the Villains & Vigilantes fan group on Facebook. We haven't been 'silent'. But we haven't been encouraging you folks to abandon this page and go over there, since we want this to be a healthy forum as well. Sorry for the inconvenience.

We are not at all disappointed with the outcome of the lawsuit. The most important goal, in our minds, was to avoid having to compete with our own earlier editions of V&V when we released the new edition. We are now the sole publishers of all of those editions, which is a huge win. There's really not much we didn't get that's of any importance, and we would have had to raise another chunk of cash and go back to courts to do it. Seriously, this outcome is *fine*.

As for our release schedule, well, you're not wrong. We've been moving slowly. But we *are* moving. Thanks for your patience.

-Jeff

Hireling
High-Powered Superhero
Posts: 95
Post Re: Cyber Monday: LULU Sale 35% Off Today
on: November 29, 2018, 10:10

Thanks for the reply, Jeff. I'm glad to hear that this site is getting some tech support. I can only speak for myself, but I would love to see some updates, progress shots, doodles--anything associated with the release schedule. If this isn't possible, I understand. Best of luck and thanks again for everything you do.

drl2
Street-Level Hero
Posts: 21
Post Re: Cyber Monday: LULU Sale 35% Off Today
on: November 29, 2018, 15:58

On the technical issue, what I experienced was a banned IP address - which went away after my FIOS service went down for a day and assigned me a new address when it came back up. I know that some of the CAPTCHA plugins for Wordpress are known to be overzealous about locking out IPs, so looking into the one you're using might be a starting point.

My Gaming Blog

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