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Author Topic: Shaping
RhinoDino1-
973
Street-Level Hero
Posts: 19
Post Shaping
on: June 28, 2018, 06:09

Hi, I have some questions regarding the shaping ability. I can't get my head wrapped around this ability.

1. Does a hero with shaping automatically create the energy to make shapes or do you need a separate energy power? Also, can this same hero shape any existing physical material within range?

2. The rules imply the shapes don't attack without taking the animation mod. How does that work? Can a shape still be used for a melee or ranged attack?

Thank you your help!

bkadams
Cosmic Superhero
Posts: 589
Post Re: Shaping
on: June 28, 2018, 09:38

1. Does a hero with shaping automatically create the energy to make shapes or do you need a separate energy power? Not sure exactly what you mean but the default PR cost for Shaping is 1 Power. Example: a hero with 60 Power uses his Shaping ability in Round 1, dropping his Power from 60 to 59.

Also, can this same hero shape any existing physical material within range? This falls more under the Transmutation ability than the Shaping ability, although a character could have Transmutation as a subset of his Shaping ability and receive a modifier of (-5) to its cost.

2. The rules imply the shapes don't attack without taking the animation mod. How does that work? Can a shape still be used for a melee or ranged attack? You cannot directly attack with Shaping. If you want it to create weapons or be able to use it for ranged attacks, you should apply the (-5) Shapes Modifier to another ability like Special Weapon, Power Blast, etc.

RhinoDino1-
973
Street-Level Hero
Posts: 19
Post Re: Shaping
on: June 28, 2018, 10:49

I'm still lost. Let me ask another way. With the shaping power, a super can spend PR, create something from inert matter or kinetic energy, correct? The inert matter or kinetic energy just appears as whatever shape is desired, sized per the PR spent and SR, correct? I also understand the energy type can be changed if desired from the default (pg 65).

I read that shaping can't be used to directly attack a target like power blast. I get that. However, it can be used as an area attack by creating a shape above a target and dropping it. I'm not clear why a super couldn't create a warhammer, pick it up, and use it in melee or throw it. The animation mod allows attacks with shaping but I interpreted that as a type of telekenisis in that the super manipulates the shape at range for attacks, like a living weapon.

Finally, if I have shaping with the requires source mod, couldn't that super rip up some sidewalk and reconfigure into a wall, or block, or whatever?

I keep thinking that shaping is the Green Lantern power, so perhaps my frame of reference is flawed and keeping me from getting this. Thanks!

Hireling
Superhero
Posts: 45
Post Re: Shaping
on: June 28, 2018, 16:23

Page 64 "You can't ‘blast’ a target with a shape, but you could drop it on an
area or use it as an improvised weapon (see 4.14.7)." So yes, you can use it to make an improvised weapon. You can find the rules on how much damage they do on Page 117, section 4.14.7.

Also, from the errata:
"SHAPING (p.64)
The character must specify which type of matter or energy their character will be able to Shape when this Ability is taken (examples: steel, hardwood, flame, etc.)."

I hope this helps!

Majestic
Cosmic Superhero
Posts: 3389
Post Re: Shaping
on: July 1, 2018, 00:31

bk, I think what Rhino is saying with his question is he's wondering if you need to otherwise generate the energy (or matter) before one can take the Shaping Ability. In other words, can a character take Shaping alone and create ice? Or does one have to have Ice Abilities first?

The answer would be (if I'm understanding the question correctly) that you can simply take Shaping by itself and specify what type of energy (or matter) you create. So you could choose Ice, just like you could choose fire/flame. One might consider the synergy of first taking Ice Abilities first, because you can also then take Shaping and get it for 5 CP less (allowing you to then shape Ice). But you're not required to do so.

Hireling (and bkadams) already answered your question on the Warhammer. You could do so, but it normally would be an unbalanced improvised weapon. You could take Special Weapon and take Shaping (at -5 CP) as a modifier so that you create the Warhammer (let's say out of some sort of metal like iron, if iron is what you chose as the matter you're able to shape), and then it wouldn't have that restriction (and thus you wouldn't be attacking with it at -3 as an improvised weapon).

This power (Ability) is very much used to simulate the power you see with Green Lantern, just as its earlier incarnation (Solid Energy Illusions) did in 2.0/2.1. It very much is the ability to create something (from seemingly nothing) and then wield it powerfully. You just have to work a little bit (and pay for it) if you want to do so as a weapon.

As to your very first question, about whether or not the character can then shape any of that substance (whether or not they created it), you could do so as long as you didn't take the 'Requires Source' modifier. So if you chose iron, you could move up to an existing castle (with iron bars) and manipulate the existing iron, without even creating any of your own.

V&V GM and player since 1982 (my current campaign is 22 years old); also run West End Games d6 Star Wars monthly, as well as the occasional The One Ring and Marvel Heroic Roleplaying game

RhinoDino1-
973
Street-Level Hero
Posts: 19
Post Re: Shaping
on: July 1, 2018, 20:29

Thanks everyone. I think this ability makes a little more sense to me now, though I'm not 100% clear on it, which is fine.

This was mentioned a couple times in that you can take Shaping as a modifier. I didn't know that was possible. Did I miss that in the Modifier section? I can't find it in the rules.

Thanks!

Majestic
Cosmic Superhero
Posts: 3389
Post Re: Shaping
on: July 3, 2018, 04:18

You bet, RhinoDino. That part about the Modifier is found under Shaping, rather than in the Modifiers section. So on p. 65 it reads:

Shaping Modifier: Shape Abilities
The character can buy Abilities for their shapes at a cost
adjustment of (-5) on that Ability. For example, a character who
creates bird shapes might want to give their Shapes the Flight
Ability.

V&V GM and player since 1982 (my current campaign is 22 years old); also run West End Games d6 Star Wars monthly, as well as the occasional The One Ring and Marvel Heroic Roleplaying game

RhinoDino1-
973
Street-Level Hero
Posts: 19
Post Re: Shaping
on: July 3, 2018, 10:48

Doh! Thanks, Majestic. I understand now. Wrapping my head around the abilities and modifiers has proved challenging for me, but that's why these forums are so helpful.

Majestic
Cosmic Superhero
Posts: 3389
Post Re: Shaping
on: July 5, 2018, 00:54

No problem at all. Glad to help!

V&V GM and player since 1982 (my current campaign is 22 years old); also run West End Games d6 Star Wars monthly, as well as the occasional The One Ring and Marvel Heroic Roleplaying game

Hireling
Superhero
Posts: 45
Post Re: Shaping
on: July 5, 2018, 13:48

Mind if I piggyback my question onto this thread?

Weather Control B) Command Weather - Rain: Can’t mold or lift it – it’s just water, (-10) CPs

I'm probably missing something, but what good is water shaping?

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