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Author Topic: Mystery solved: Most Wanted volume 2
Guest
Cosmic Superhero
Posts: 135
Post Mystery solved: Most Wanted volume 2
on: June 30, 2012, 09:02

I've heard the question asked many times over the years (and I've asked it myself) "Whatever happened to Most Wanted volume 2?"

About two years ago, Jeff came forward and solved the mystery in a single message!

http://www.villainsandvigilantesforum.com/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1270071383/32#32

The entire thread is only two pages long, so you can get the whole conversation there.

After carefully reading his "explanation", I had some reservations about it. I've included my analysis/response to each point of his "explanation" here.
===========
Jeff Dee wrote on Apr 25th, 2010 at 9:42am:
Wow. You guys are still talking about this?

Here's the explanation.

1) The adventures published by FGU do not represent a single coherent continuity. Each individual author's adventures take place in their own private parallel world. None of it is "canon" as far as the core universe created by Jack Herman and myself is concerned.

Lionmane's response: So what? This has nothing to do with the explanation.

2) Most Wanted was intended to be a series of books detailing villains from our core universe. Jack wrote MW1, and I was writing MW2.

Lionmane's response: This says Jeff Dee was assigned the project of "Most Wanted volume 2". This means "Most Wanted volume 2" is JEFF DEE'S responsibility.

3) FGU ceased to be a real company (no promotion, no convention appearances, no solicitation of distributors) before I finished MW2. I therefor stopped working on MW2.

Lionmane's response: The part about "FGU ceased to be a real company" is false. You can cry about 1991, New York, and unpaid taxes all you want. The court case has ALREADY RULED that Fantasy Games Unlimited never stopped doing business.

But what most people probably missed here is that Jeff (quietly) admitted that he "stopped working on MW2". So there you have it. The reason YOU don't have Most Wanted volume 2 is because Jeff did not fulfill his responsibilities.

4) MW3 was not supposed to be MW3. It does not contain any official information from the setting I shared with Jack. But FGU released it as MW3 anyway, without consulting us.

Lionmane's response: Most Wanted volume 3 was not Jeff's responsibility. And I don't think Scott is required to consult with Jeff on V&V products (look at all the stuff that's been released the past two years without Jeff's permission). Anyway, the part about "without consulting us" is (in my opinion) a misrepresentation of the facts. If Jeff didn't know about Most Wanted volume 3 it probably has more to do with the fact that Jeff simply didn't care enough to stay in touch with Scott.

5) Why did FGU leave a "gap" for MW2? Because Scott Bizar is a lunatic. Despite his company dwindling to nothing, despite his refusal to relinquish the rights when he was no longer in any position to uphold his responsibilities as a publisher, and despite having insulted us creatively by releasing a book that craps all over our continuity, he still thought I would eventually finish MW2 and hand it over to him. He probably STILL believes that.

Lionmane's response: Why did FGU leave a "gap" for MW:2? Because Scott Bizar was under the mistaken impression that Jeff Dee is mature enough to fulfill his responsibilities and fully expected Jeff Dee to turn in the manuscript for Most Wanted volume 2. But I guess Jeff Dee really showed Scott, huh?

I am in the process of finishing up what would have been MW2 for release as a Living Legends book. No release date has been announced.

Lionmane's response: Oh, what have we here? So not only did Jeff *not* turn in Most Wanted volume 2 to Scott, he KEPT it for 25 years! What better way to say "I don't care about the fans" than this?

-Jeff Dee
UNIgames

DSumner
Cosmic Superhero
Posts: 1532
Post Re: Mystery solved: Most Wanted volume 2
on: June 30, 2012, 11:24

Lionmane, I'm not trying to be rude, or insult you, but some of your more recent postings are coming across as nothing more than trolling. I can understand your frustration, and desire to see new product from MHG, but the fact is that with the ongoing litigation, things are pretty much in a holding pattern until MHG and FGU either reach a settlement, or the courts issue a ruling. So until then, my best advice to everyone, is to relax, continue playing a game we all seem to enjoy, and let the actual parties involved in this work things out. Getting upset about the slow pace of releases isn't going to do you, or anyone else any good.

With that said, I really hope that all of this will come to a conclusion soon, and that everyone involved in this will be able to come to some sort agreement that will allow a great game to continue to be published and enjoyed by the fans, without either side taking it on the chin in the process, as I've got no beef with anyone involved.

dan2448
Cosmic Superhero
Posts: 907
Post Re: Mystery solved: Most Wanted volume 2
on: June 30, 2012, 11:30

Your commentary seems a little harsh to me, Lionmane, to be honest.

I agree that it's disappointing MW2 was never published. And, blissfully unaware back in the mid-1980s of all the 'water under the bridge' between the creators and publisher, at the time I really enjoyed a number of the V&V publications put out by FGU that weren't authored by Jeff and/or Jack.I infer from the above that some of those very releases may have exacerbated tensions between creators and publisher.

That being said, in this context I always remind myself that the writing and publishing of V&V materials has probably never made anyone much money. I expect that, back in the mid-1980s when he intended to work on MW2, Jeff may well have been busy with other, more lucrative pursuits. And who am I to insist that, during any free time he had back then, he 'buckle down' and grind out MW2. I don't begrudge anyone for never finishing a 'labor of love'. (I also don't particularly begrudge the decision to publish MW3, though, when MW2 wasn't forthcoming.)

Guest
Cosmic Superhero
Posts: 135
Post Re: Mystery solved: Most Wanted volume 2
on: June 30, 2012, 12:43

Quote from DSumner on June 30, 2012, 11:24
Lionmane, I'm not trying to be rude, or insult you, but some of your more recent postings are coming across as nothing more than trolling. I can understand your frustration, and desire to see new product from MHG, but the fact is that with the ongoing litigation, things are pretty much in a holding pattern until MHG and FGU either reach a settlement, or the courts issue a ruling. So until then, my best advice to everyone, is to relax, continue playing a game we all seem to enjoy, and let the actual parties involved in this work things out. Getting upset about the slow pace of releases isn't going to do you, or anyone else any good.

With that said, I really hope that all of this will come to a conclusion soon, and that everyone involved in this will be able to come to some sort agreement that will allow a great game to continue to be published and enjoyed by the fans, without either side taking it on the chin in the process, as I've got no beef with anyone involved.

I'm sorry, Dom (everyone).

But you're right. I am frustrated. I was already frustrated when I asked this:

Quote from Lionmane on June 28, 2012, 07:07
Any new products? It's been ten months since any new product has been announced (August, 27: Ancient Evil).

Are you guys going to even post a "villain bonus" or whatever? Maybe post some stats on some characters or something?

How 'bout Freedom Eagle? Since Freedom Eagle is dead (and unlikely to be posted in any new product), why not post his stats? Intercontinental Ballistic Man? Anything at all?

Is MHG still in business?

But instead of getting an answer, I get people running interference. And on top of that, I get my expectations invalidated:

Quote from someone on June 29, 2012, 15:00
You will NOT find anywhere that those efforts were on there way by MHG management. Jeff and Jack have never published a release schedule of future work and have never announced the work before it was ready to release.

Whatever source you had about the upcoming "Suicide Mission" and "Most Wanted: Vol 2" wasn't official or from Jeff and Jack.

(I was going to find the reference to "Suicide Mission" next).

And don't forget this piece of encouragement:

Quote from an excited fan on June 29, 2012, 15:19
This site, consequently, is going to be essentially a V&V home-brew discussion and movie comments page for the foreseeable future.

I know who wins the lawsuit, btw.

<SPOILERS>
No one...
</SPOILERS>

Sleepwalke-
r
Cosmic Superhero
Posts: 147
Post Re: Mystery solved: Most Wanted volume 2
on: July 3, 2012, 09:24

Wow. A real live bonafide psycho.

Oh well.
Hey! Amazing Spider-Man opens today. Set to earn like Avengers.
I'm a little leary of the Twilight vibe, sure, but after the botch job of Spiderman 3, they had no choice but to reboot the franchise to keep making Spidey movies. And I want them to keep making Spidey movies.

Guest
Cosmic Superhero
Posts: 135
Post Re: Mystery solved: Most Wanted volume 2
on: July 3, 2012, 11:22

When Spider-Man 2 came out, I think I remember Tobey McGuire had said something about being tired of making Spider-Man movies. At the time, my impression was that it was a publicity stunt designed to get more money for the role.

It looks like he got his wish. Maybe they'll make a sequel to Pleasantville.

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